ethics, please

[Czy Horse]

Years ago when they offered the International Bow Hunter Education Course here in Ontario, they stated that 80% of the deer shot at 21 yards or less where found within 100 yards, move out to 26 yards and 80% of the deer are not recovered inside 100 yards. Every time I pull up my crossbow I'm reminded of this statement. Personally I still think the IBHEC should be manditory to get a bow hunting tag.

[Petersen]

thanks for the input guys! I am a new x-bow hunter and have learned a great deal from all of your posts. I have not shot a deer yet with my x-bow, although have had several chances. I want my first kill to be perfect so I keep passing deer up waiting for the right shot. I had this chance a few week ago, but managed to miss nayways. So there you go....even in a perfect situation, things can go wrong. I was just lucky enough to shoot too high and misssed clean.

Keep up the good work guys......we've got a really great bunch of sportsman/women here!

[ch312]

Some guy on the OOD site right now is promoting neck shots.

seriously?

on deer i dont think you should ever take anything but a heart/lung shot. it is the largest target to hit on a deer allowing the most forgiveness. no deer is going to go very far with a couple holes in its lungs.

last season i shot a doe that was quartering towards me at about 12 yards. i managed to get both lungs and clip the heart but even with my exomax i didnt get a pass through. ill never take a shot like that again.

people seem to get the impression that if someone did or said something on the internet than it must be a good idea....

[roland]

I agree with this I let 3 walk away this year because of poor shooting angles.

[Cossack]

My hunting partner shot a buck with an arrow stocking out of it's head during gun season; which he kept quiet about. That image does (all) hunting no good.

[FredBear]

Wabi thanks for saying it. It HAD to be said. I have seen ALOT of poor shot angles here this season.

[sumner4991]

Wabi thanks for saying it. It HAD to be said. I have seen ALOT of poor shot angles here this season.

So have I. However, give the hunter the benefit of a doubt. The place where the arrow ended up may not have been where it was intended to hit. There are a vatiety of reasons for a near miss too.

You should take the shot you are comfortable with taking. That is different for each of us. There is no way you can say someone was unethical unless you know their skill level. A 20 yard broadside could be an unethical shot for some. While a 40 yard neck shot may be perfectly OK for others. It's all a matter of skill level.

I agree that we have a "duty" to ourselves to take a shot in which we are very confident in making. However, there are few shots in which we can judge without knowing more than just looking at the pictures.

[FredBear]

So have I. However, give the hunter the benefit of a doubt. The place where the arrow ended up may not have been where it was intended to hit. There are a vatiety of reasons for a near miss too.

You should take the shot you are comfortable with taking. That is different for each of us. There is no way you can say someone was unethical unless you know their skill level. A 20 yard broadside could be an unethical shot for some. While a 40 yard neck shot may be perfectly OK for others. It's all a matter of skill level.

I agree that we have a "duty" to ourselves to take a shot in which we are very confident in making. However, there are few shots in which we can judge without knowing more than just looking at the pictures.

Agreed.

[xbhntr]

I agree with Wabi; but also is responsible is the T.V. media!! These PROS. give the rookies the inspiration that they too; can make that Idiot shot of 70 yards or better!! Tim Wells and Fred Eikler have made some stupid shots. Yes, they practise, but edit it out . These examples create macho hunters. Ray JUST MY OPINION !!

[Sopchoppy]

My hunting partner shot a buck with an arrow stocking out of it's head during gun season; which he kept quiet about. That image does (all) hunting no good.

I deal with the same thing with my hunting buddy. I'm trying to break him from taking very questionable shots with bow or gun. If he can see it, he will shoot at it. With a bow, he usually misses but has some kills with the entry wound in a lousy place. With gun, he hit's and kills but it may take 2 shots because the first was not a good decision.

[huntone]

Great post Wabi,

I practice with my crossbow enough to be able to hit, at 30 yds., inside 1 1/2 inch, every time, but yet this year when I took a doe, 20 yds, the shot was 3 inchs from where I was aiming. I was aiming for the lungs, a high percentage shot. I don't know what happened. Why did the arrow go where it did?
There was no wind, I was calm, I had confidence, so what happened?

Our Excaliburs are an amazing hunting tool. They are the highest quality,
accurate, and very well made. But.....I don't have the confidence with my Ibex I have with my Remington Model seven.

If it can go wrong....It will.

[Tom]

There have been alot of great posts on this thread.

To be ethical, is, or should be mandatory for all sportsman/woman. But like what has been said above ....... |What is ethical?

To me ...... ethical is (when hunting) ...... The taking of a shot that will dispatch the animal very quickly at over 95% of the time. In my mind, if I am certain that my arrow will pass through the KILL ZONE of that animal, I will take the shot.

About head shots, I have killed a deer with a head shot, but it was accidental. I was not aiming for the head, but that was where the arrow hit. I had miss judged the distance and with the deer looking back at me, instead of going over the back (this was not a bad angle shot, broadside with the deer looking 270* angle over its back), I hit the head. A bad experience with a head shot, I tracked a deer (buck) that ducked the arrow (I actually think the deer tried to catch the arrow with the antlers) from a head on shot. It took the arrow in the bridge of the nose ..... well we let the deer have 2 hours then tracked for over 4 hours across fields, ponds, swamps, and a river. Lost it at the river. Head shots might be ok with a gun, but in my opinion never with archery equipment.

For anyone to say anything about someone for not taking a shot because they were not comfortable with that shot .... well that is unethical. For you to be really truly accurate ..... You must be not only comfortable with your choice of hunting tool, but comfortable with your shot.

Wabi ....... GREAT POST and every once in a while it is always great to bring up ethics if only to reinforce what is generally ethical for all. And for all the other great additions to this post, thanks for again establishing a general code for ethics for all, not just the new shooters.

[macobow]

Sumner, with all due respect, I disagree with you. An expert marksman with a rifle doing a neck shot at 40 yards might be OK, but not with an arrow or xbow bolt. If the deer reacts even slightly at the sound of the shot the result would be a wounded deer. We have a duty to the animal as well as ourselves to not take risky shots. I'm glad Wabi brought up this topic.

[sumner4991]

Sumner, with all due respect, I disagree with you. An expert marksman with a rifle doing a neck shot at 40 yards might be OK, but not with an arrow or xbow bolt. If the deer reacts even slightly at the sound of the shot the result would be a wounded deer. We have a duty to the animal as well as ourselves to not take risky shots. I'm glad Wabi brought up this topic.

I didn't mean for my post to sound like I am OK with a 40 yard neck shot. I know two archers that shoot quail on the fly and are deadly shots. If either of these guys came in with a deer that was shot in the neck at 40 yards, then I would say nice shot and leave it at that because I know their skill level and I know these guys would not take a shot that they were not going to make a quick kill.

I can also add that neither of these guys has ever taken a deer from more than 30 yards and never a neck shot. At least not that they have told the story.

I'm just trying to make the point that we can not judge by pictures alone.

I also disagree with your accessment of a 40 yard neck shot. If the deer reacts at all, it's probably a clean miss. Taking a neck shot is nothing more than trying to show off. Probably over compensating for something. Seriously, it would depend on which end of the "neck" the hunter was shooting at too. I've taken clean head and neck shots, but, from less than 15 yards on wounded deer.

I really agree with wabi . . .some shots should never be taken. But, unless you know more information, then it's not right to judge.

Sopchoppy has every right to be pissed at his hunting partner. He has the facts.

[wabi]

I really agree with wabi . . .some shots should never be taken. But, unless you know more information, then it's not right to judge.

My intent was not to judge or criticize anyone - it was to point out to the newcomers that many of the shots they see in the posts should not be attempted unless you're an expert (and even then it depends on a lot of other factors).

I won't even attempt a spine shot!

I hold out for the heart/lung area on a broadside deer (or slightly quartering away).

I hope those who have posted pics of some hits outside the heart/lung area don't take offense at my post, but if they do they probably were just plain lucky and shouldn't have attempted the shot in the first place.