Speculation thread on the limbs breaking....

[vixenmaster]

Interesting. Seems everyone who owns an Exomax doesn't have the internet to speak their voice.

If I Google "Exomax limb failure", nothing comes up but splinters, which is still a functioning bow, not failure.

Then I Google "Matrix limb failure", and you could spend a month reading.

One bow has been out almost 20 years, the other 2 years.
Something smells fishy about those numbers.

David maybe BowTech is havin too much input on limbs ?
I love the smaller platforms, the size n weight makes them most comfortable in use. I would like to see a data break-down of broken limbs per model ?

[Pydpiper]

Interesting. Seems everyone who owns an Exomax doesn't have the internet to speak their voice.

If I Google "Exomax limb failure", nothing comes up but splinters, which is still a functioning bow, not failure.

Then I Google "Matrix limb failure", and you could spend a month reading.

One bow has been out almost 20 years, the other 2 years.
Something smells fishy about those numbers.

David maybe BowTech is havin too much input on limbs ?
I love the smaller platforms, the size n weight makes them most comfortable in use. I would like to see a data break-down of broken limbs per model ?

Perhaps Mike, Only difference I have noticed with Excalibur is that they took the "Excalibur" sign off the building last time I was there, could have been just to paint, don't know.
As far as numbers, I doubt you will ever see them, although interesting it would be. I have no financial interest in Excalibur, they won me over with their service, and will always have me as a customer for that reason.
I just find it odd that my research and experience completely contradicts Peters numbers.
Our bows are very important to us, and I have complete faith in them, the issues with the new bows concern me, as a consumer, and the fact that there seems to be some "mistruths" about damage rates isn't helping.
Either way, happy hunting!

[amythntr]

....I'm gonna try to take the high road here...let me preface this by saying I too have experienced limb failures so I have not been immune. I have to say each time I have experienced issues I have been met with a company that has jumped through hoops to try (and did) help...

....My opinion is that it is ludicrous and potentially suicidal for a company to lie about what it states publicly...so until I have further information I will stay on the sidelines going forward....I think Excalibur realizes their reputation is extremely important and i would want to believe that if there are any issues they are working diligently to resolve it....

....Finally, in the mean time I have two extra set of limbs which I have purchased (blemishes as others have)....In addition, I have a backup 335 which I won at Boofest....I have also offered to help people that were in a bind with 335 limbs...meaning, they are awaiting warranty limbs or return phone calls...I have and am doing this on my own...so if anyone is in a bind...PM me...

....My opinion is, this too shall pass....

Anthony

[vixenmaster]

David, like you i have been an Excal user from the 1st crossbow in 96. I also will ride the river wid'em, i have 3 diff Series Excals. The Exo, Matrix n Micro n they each have great user friendly aspects

[Pydpiper]

The micro makes my heart beat funny. First time I seen it I was sure it would be too small for me. I was wrong, everything about it felt right.
Right now I use my wife's bow, and will continue to do so until this is fixed. Ibex for me. Won't win any coolness points in a bow show, but it let's me focus on the real issue with my hunting, me.

[L. E. Carroll]

I'm sure Peter and the rest of Employees of Excalibur are great people you and I would love to share a hunting camp with. (I Know I would ) But lets keep in mind, they all also work for Excal.. That is what pays their bills, puts food on their tables, and sends their kids thru college.

Likewise, insurance companies have "Adjusters" who's job it is to save the company as much money as possible when dealing with claims. That' what they are hired to do ! Do I believe them when they tell me my truck is only worth SO MUCH and NO MORE when it comes "Claim Time? ( just to save them additional $$ )......NO !!! that's why you get advised by friends and lawyers ( and State Insurance Commission's if needed ) who will advise you to get additional quotes and true values for your loss.

Until this gets resolved, they or any company, will try and make you happy at the least cost to the Company ( and stock holders if they have them) . Re-tooling and R&D cost $$$

Repairs are cheaper and if they can get you spend a few more bucks by suggesting you buy a set of "Blem" back-up limbs "just in case" Well that's a couple more dollars in the stockholders or companies pockets. (while applying no additional pressure to get to the Root cause of the failures. )

The only real way to get the issue resolved is to by continuing to shoot your older models and possibly those Matrix bows which have no real history of failure...

If we, as the buying public, would leave the Micros and high stress faster bows setting on the shelf long enough, maybe additional research would be done to find and resolve this breakage issue. I can tell you as long as the excepted 1 in 50 bow failires in the case of the Micros is excepted and continues I'll never buy one.

I'm pretty sure the failure causes of the later two may probably just be brace height issues. I'm of the opinion that many of the 380 and 405 limb and limb tip issues could be solved by simply including a stringing device and good instructions with it In The Box before purchase.

Personally , I'm at the " leaving on the shelf " stage with the Micros and their short limbs and extreme limb stress issues... Possibly if sales dropped or became non-existent on this particullar model more research, instead of band-aids would solve it's issues.

This will be my last post on this issue. We All Know It Exists, no matter how much you love it.... Many will go to the grave supporting Excalibur on this issue and never force a thing be done to research and resolve it.

myself I'm gonna turn this tablet off and GO HUNTING ( with my trusty 355 or Axiom.}

Gene

[amythntr]

The micro makes my heart beat funny. First time I seen it I was sure it would be too small for me. I was wrong, everything about it felt right.
Right now I use my wife's bow, and will continue to do so until this is fixed. Ibex for me. Won't win any coolness points in a bow show, but it let's me focus on the real issue with my hunting, me.

....I got to hold an older IBEX on Saturday....it is sweet!

Anthony

PS...but I am true to my .....Bada Bing ....

[one shot scott]

I'm sure Peter and the rest of Employees of Excalibur are great people you and I would love to share a hunting camp with. (I Know I would ) But lets keep in mind, they all also work for Excal.. That is what pays their bills, puts food on their tables, and sends their kids thru college.

Likewise, insurance companies have "Adjusters" who's job it is to save the company as much money as possible when dealing with claims. That' what they are hired to do ! Do I believe them when they tell me my truck is only worth SO MUCH and NO MORE when it comes "Claim Time? ( just to save them additional $$ )......NO !!! that's why you get advised by friends and lawyers ( and State Insurance Commission's if needed ) who will advise you to get additional quotes and true values for your loss.

Until this gets resolved, they or any company, will try and make you happy at the least cost to the Company ( and stock holders if they have them) . Re-tooling and R&D cost $$$

Repairs are cheaper and if they can get you spend a few more bucks by suggesting you buy a set of "Blem" back-up limbs "just in case" Well that's a couple more dollars in the stockholders or companies pockets. (while applying no additional pressure to get to the Root cause of the failures. )

The only real way to get the issue resolved is to by continuing to shoot your older models and possibly those Matrix bows which have no real history of failure...

If we, as the buying public, would leave the Micros and high stress faster bows setting on the shelf long enough, maybe additional research would be done to find and resolve this breakage issue. I can tell you as long as the excepted 1 in 50 bow failires in the case of the Micros is excepted and continues I'll never buy one.

I'm pretty sure the failure causes of the later two may probably just be brace height issues. I'm of the opinion that many of the 380 and 405 limb and limb tip issues could be solved by simply including a stringing device and good instructions with it In The Box before purchase.

Personally , I'm at the " leaving on the shelf " stage with the Micros and their short limbs and extreme limb stress issues... Possibly if sales dropped or became non-existent on this particullar model more research, instead of band-aids would solve it's issues.

This will be my last post on this issue. We All Know It Exists, no matter how much you love it.... Many will go to the grave supporting Excalibur on this issue and never force a thing be done to research and resolve it.

myself I'm gonna turn this tablet off and GO HUNTING ( with my trusty 355 or Axiom.}

Gene

I get where you are coming and I think I understand your angle, but Excalibur was/is not the type of company that puts off a needed recall at for the sake of the bottom line. This much I will give them! They did a recall on the 405 triggers after one post on here about a problem. Ecalibur doesn't dick around! If they did that then all my excaliburs are for sale!
I don't have a micro for reasons recently clear, That, and $...lol, but I will at some point. Excal WILL look after folks and if there is a real problem they will do what is needed. the spare limbs are a choice that gets publicity on the forum, Excalibur does not recommend buying some. You can always get free limbs IF you ever experience an issue

[kd8jgu]

I have read some have had problems some have not
Just an idea
How about those having problems put in there bolt weight
Those having no problems put in there bolt weight
Lets see if it could be a weight problem
I know Excalibur says 350 min most other xbows with these speeds are say 400+

[Buszone]

OK, OK I have read this stuff about failures for weeks... I thought this old stick flinger would enter the fray. I have owned more bows then most over the years . I bought PSE's Mach 4 when it came out great bow and was the fasted rated on the market at 78lb 50% let off. I promptly put a 3" over draw on it and shot
25 1/2" xx75s well over the course of 100's of shots I blew the cams off three times, had a cable break and it would take weeks to get fixed. However, I loved it because as a single pin shooter I was all but dead on from 10 to 30 I always had a spare bow. I had recurves where the tips delaminated, when I get ready for gun season I don't just sight in 1 rifle because "crap" happens. When I take a hunting trip I pack a pre sighted mounted scope. Why because I had a gold ring that the reticle broke in the middle of a hunt.
I made the move to Excalibur this past spring "Because" my Ten point was recalled and that was before the left hand wheel broke which took three weeks for parts! Plus it was like being in the tree with 12 lb 6 wheel Jennings strapped to a 2x6. So I decided that I would get a bow that I could do most of the work myself and had a good corporate service record and that's Excalibur. I don't care what you buy "crap" happens! I will admit I was concerned when they were purchased by Bowtech but so far so good.
I always avoided the new and shiny first year products but I could not help myself when I saw the mighty "THOR" !!
So, I learned to expect issues thus I bought a spare set of arms for "THOR" so if he has a problem I can get him back to throwing his battle axe in under an hour! and if something happens that I cannot fix the same day I'm sure Excalibur will do the right thing..Oh and I can always hunt with my Vbow.

[Drew]

I'm also a mechanical engineer and work with mass produced products. (one of the big three automotive companies. Hint, we don't require government bailouts!) Anyway, I'm perplexed as Excal limbs are not especially exotic. They are not some wonder fiber super limb as far as I'm aware (basically long glass and resin). And standard testing would and should have shown these types of failures. Excal should be running cycle life testing on limbs (to destruction), over flex cycling, dry firing, static load and force drop-off after prolonged loading, etc, basically A LOT of testing. You would not believe the testing automotive companies do (it really NEVER stops). Failure occurrence should be measured and quantifiable, as in 1/1000, which we would consider A LOT (obviously this is volume dependent).

Perhaps they should look into a layered, bias ply carbon fiber "matrix" limb. It would cost more sure but I would love to see this personally.

I wonder if they could ship all bows unstrung to alleviate the smashed REDS syndrome. It's not like most bow shops or mass sellers (Dunham's, even Cabela's) have highly trained bow techs. I've seen dozens of Excals with the string smashing the bumpers. Another stress that most likely was never "tested" to know it's long term impacts. I was kind of shocked that my crossbow, new in box, was already strung. But then I remembered Excal doesn't ship bows with stringers.

Till then I'll continue shooting my M355 which has only every had one limb issue and it was a big splinter which was replaced with minimal hassle. I'll wait awhile before pursuing the M405 and watch from the sidelines to see how this all rolls out.

[amythntr]

OK, OK I have read this stuff about failures for weeks... I thought this old stick flinger would enter the fray. I have owned more bows then most over the years . I bought PSE's Mach 4 when it came out great bow and was the fasted rated on the market at 78lb 50% let off. I promptly put a 3" over draw on it and shot
25 1/2" xx75s well over the course of 100's of shots I blew the cams off three times, had a cable break and it would take weeks to get fixed. However, I loved it because as a single pin shooter I was all but dead on from 10 to 30 I always had a spare bow. I had recurves where the tips delaminated, when I get ready for gun season I don't just sight in 1 rifle because "crap" happens. When I take a hunting trip I pack a pre sighted mounted scope. Why because I had a gold ring that the reticle broke in the middle of a hunt.
I made the move to Excalibur this past spring "Because" my Ten point was recalled and that was before the left hand wheel broke which took three weeks for parts! Plus it was like being in the tree with 12 lb 6 wheel Jennings strapped to a 2x6. So I decided that I would get a bow that I could do most of the work myself and had a good corporate service record and that's Excalibur. I don't care what you buy "crap" happens! I will admit I was concerned when they were purchased by Bowtech but so far so good.
I always avoided the new and shiny first year products but I could not help myself when I saw the mighty "THOR" !!
So, I learned to expect issues thus I bought a spare set of arms for "THOR" so if he has a problem I can get him back to throwing his battle axe in under an hour! and if something happens that I cannot fix the same day I'm sure Excalibur will do the right thing..Oh and I can always hunt with my Vbow.

....can we get an Amen on this from Buszone!

....Very well said, but i do understand the other side of the story also....

Anthony

[GRUNDY]

One thing to keep in mind is that Excalibur is no longer truly Excalibur.

Excalibur is now owned by Norwest Equity partners.

http://nep.com/connect/news/norwest-equ ... -crossbow/

I really wish good companies like Excalibur could find ways to stay privately held when the original owner wants out/wants to cash in on his/her hard work.

Brian