Ray lost some land, now so did I

[crazyfarmer]

RayD posted that he had just lost some land to guys paying more cash.. well I called a landowner that I had been hunting for 8 years(farm the land also LOL) and she told me that the local hunt club might be renting the land to deer hunt this year. I was the one hunting the track and was actaully doing a great job of letting small bucks grow into shooters. Now the club that shoots everything with legs is going to rent the land. Not that it matters, but its sad to see hunting is becoming a money thing. If one person pays one landowner money to hunt land, then the others want money also for you to hunt their land

I know the club and they want the land since I kill a few good bucks their every season... what they dont know is that its big bucks there because the small ones actaully can grow. They must think bucks are born 12pointers and etc LOL

so add me to the lost land to more money list

[kev]

It's mostly Duck and Goose hunters around me paying. I lost a few places where I varmint hunt to them. Both places had big ponds. The one farmer told me he get's $5.00 acre lease, 465 acres total. These guy's don't hunt anything but Duck's and Geese and nobody else is allowed any hunting.

Me and another guy have been paying $250.00 ($125.00 ea.) a year to bowhunt for the last 4 years. About 250 acres in an Urban zone. I don't know how much the Duck/Goose/Dove hunters pay the owner it's been the same 3 guy's since I've hunted there. I figure someone will eventually up the price and I'll be looking for another spot.

I figure in another 10 years everyone will be paying. I don't blame the farmers and I'd do the same. The game club I belong to does'nt give them any money, just a couple of big picnics with door prizes.

[raydaughety]

I got my place back but I sure do feel for you. It's the crazyest thing that I've ever seen. I'm in a gun club also that's owned by a large timber company, we went from paying $4.50 an acre to $7.00 an acre. A club near us is paying $12.00 an acre. We called their bluff and sent them a check for $5.00 an acre and they renewed our lease but warned that it would increase again next year. That club is under the QDMA program but we're looking at dropping it. We're feeding the deer year round via food plots (no shooting in the plots) keeping the roads up, letting the young bucks walk, everything to make the habit better for future generations and they try and pull this crap. We vote in the issue at our meeting this Saturday night and most members that in the past wouldn't dream of dropping the hammer on a small buck are getting a "brown is down mentality" and frankly I agree. After what I went through this year with the farm, I am a firm believer that if you want a place to hunt for your retirement years and for your kids and grand kids, you'd better take a look at buying a place of your own. Whew, it's almost midnight and I'm too mad to go to sleep just thinking about it. Good luck to Crazyfarmer, you know that your welcome come down to my place anytime.

God Bless,

[vapredhunter]

That sucks, I know what you mean, people around here practice the if its brown it's down mentality. In Maryland were I'm from we had 100's of acres to hunt and we only shot 8 point or better wider then the ears. I tried to get the guys that hunt the farms I hunt down here to do the same they just laugh at me and shoot whatever they see. The money deal sucks I had permission to hunt a couple of farms that are now leased. The future of our sport sucks between the new housing and pay to hunt soon I won't have any place to hunt but National Forest. Good luck Chris,

[kev]

Thats the biggest thing here with small farms being sold for new housing builds. Especially here in the crowded Urban zone there are so many hunters and so little land. The little farm me and my partner pay to hunt is 7 miles from my house, about 4 from his. So in a way being so close we can hunt quite a bit. Really the place is loaded with Deer also, being able to leave your stands year round is nice.

I have quite a few other places 20-30 miles away I varmint hunt I could Deer hunt for free. There not in the Urban zone where you can use the extra Urban anterless tags though.

[marmot]

I do not know of a single parcel of private land in my area that is open for hunting by non-family members that is not leased to deep-pocketed clubs ($50 to $100 per acre). However, as I was telling Bob, there are a lot well-heeled horse farm owners that do not allow hunting, and for whom money is no object (one family is so wealthy that they own a professional sports team). I think that I may have found an angle to gain hunting access to these farms. Low-impact groundhog elimination is one of my specialties (I hunt with a moderated .22 caliber pre-charged pneumatic air rifle). Horse farm owners loath groundhogs, but most will not soil their hands getting rid these agricultural pests (nor will they allow firearms on their property). I am going to offer to take care of their problem in exchange for archery hunting access.

[Grizzly Adam]

Sorry to hear that, Crazy. Sign of the times, I guess.

It is my opinion that a large part of the problem is the expectation of and granting of "exclusive use" when people negotiate hunting privileges. So many of the same guys who are always whining about not having many (or any) places to hunt are the very same ones who are always wanting to secure a property all for themselves.


I let people hunt on my farm (so far) ... but I don't grant anybody exclusive use of my place. I tell everyone I let hunt here that I'll do what I want to on this land, when I want to, and that I'll let other people of my choosing hunt too, if I want. I tell them I expect cooperation and gentlemanly behavior at all times, or they won't be hunting on this property.

I bend over backwards to accomodate people who want to share my land ... to the point of putting off noisy or disruptive activity and "laying low" so they'll have the very best chances while here ... but I will not allow anyone to think they're the only ones in on a good thing, and I won't be boughten and paid for (so far).

I understand landowners who can make a substantial amount of money at it incorporating the use of their property into their financial plans, though, and cannot say that I would never agree to some sort of limited lease, if it promised to brighten my financial situation. After all, our taxes are very high, and I had to buy this place, and I have to maintain it.

Even if I did lease it, though, I think I would include a clause in the agreement that allowed me and my own guests to hunt at my discretion, because I believe it's the idea of exclusive access that pollutes hunter's minds and ruins their behavior.

Lots of hunters are like kindergarten kids when it comes to hunting land: "It's mine! Give it to me! Mine!"

I trust you're not one of them, Crazy ... but so many are.

We all need to learn to share the good stuff of life.

Just some of my thoughts.

[crazyfarmer]

Grizz, not at all.. I like to share hunting areas also but this was the one peice I had to myself since the landowner wouldnt let anyone hunt it but me for 6 years. The hunt club has about 1500 acres that borders it, but they wanted this 200 acres since I was killing decent deer off the land. Mybe its because I know how to hunt or maybe it was from letting the bucks grow. I just know I killed 2 bigger bucks there then that have on all their land in the past 4 years LOL. Im just moving my stands to another track down the road that no one hunts now.. its a PITA to get into it which is why most dont hunt it. Im also keeping my mouth shut on where I kill any decent bucks anymore also. If anyone asks, I found it dead on the road

[LV2HNT]

Sorry to hear that C.F. Atleast you still have some other places to go though. I am surprised the hunt club just didn't run dogs across the 200 acres every year to chase the deer onto their land. It used to happen constantly here even though it was illegal.

In my area we have a military base that I have hunted for ever because there is no where else to go. Any chunks of houseless land that are big enough to hunt are of limits for one reason or another. If I didn't have the base, my next option would be to drive an hour and a half away to the closest national forest which is very unrealistic. Neither place is ideal because they are very crowded public lands and I am guaranteed to have many hunts ruined because of other people. I have always dreamed of having a place of my own to manage and enjoy in complete privacy with my guests. It is so stressfull to hunt a place where you are never guaranteed a spot and one of the only ones who practices QDM. It realy does take a lot of the joys out of hunting and turns it into a (sometimes fierce) competition which it shouldn't be.

I am sorry to hear about everyone who loses their spots for any reason and I am very sorry to say that this is just another step towards our downfall. Many areas and states that are very rural still have some time to go but in my area it gets worse every year.

The high and allways increasing costs of hunting, plus the dwindeling supply of huntable land around here is murder to any real chances of increasing the hunting population and protecting our rights. When I was young and there was much more huntable land around, the military base was insanely crowded. People would sit outside in a line for days to get to go out on opening day. Now, with much less land around, there is rarely a line and if there is, it never starts more than a day before the opener. I would guess that allthough the base is still used by more people than it will accomodate, the number of hunters has dropped by atleast 3/4 compared to the way it used to be. Year after year I see people who started hunting the base because like me they had no other good allternative and year after year I see people pissed of and leaving, saying they will never go back because it is so crowded, dangerous, and regulated that they can't even enjoy a day of hunting.

As the land supply dries up, hunters will be concentrated into smaller and smaller places untill their numbers get so high that they turn on each other. Fighting over QDM, rights to spots and particular deer, methods and ethics of certain hunting techniques, etc. That will divide the hunters that remain and make quite a few give up the sport because it isn't fun any more or because they just have to go too far to find a place to go which will probably be overhunted anyway. Most beginners who want to try hunting will look at the extremely high costs of getting outfitted with all of the gear for something they might try and not like. They will look at the endless list of rules and regs that we have to learn and follow, and they will look at a map and realize how far they have to go whenever they want to hunt and probably get discouraged enough to say screw it. I think I will try something like golf instead.

So there will be hunters giving up the sport instead of passing it on to their children, family, and friends and there will be people who may have taken up the sport and supported it but never tried it because of the hassle. Also more and more hunters will become poachers thinking it's their right so they are going to go out onto someone else's land if they have to which will do nothing but make all hunters look bad to the public. That means a lot less votes come some future election that the anti's will win making our way of life extinct. You guys in rural areas filled with giant chunks of land that will last for hundreds of years may think your safe but in the suburbs, atleast this one, that is what seems to be happening and we outnumber you all in population and therefore will vote your rights away too.

[VixChix]

... in the meantime, the city dwellers complain about the deer invading their backyards, ravaging their precious little gardens and expensive ornamental shrubs...