insight on F.O.C. %..........

bob1961 · Post by **bob1961** » Wed Oct 01, 2008 9:05 am

just read a post where dan miller said he would like 100% FOC, but would settle on 25%....played with some numbers to get to 25% and came up with 21.9% with 150gr insert with my 125 slick tricks....25.7% FOC using 250gr insert weight....not many BH's that tip the scales at or over 150grs....what size alum or carbon arrow would be able to handle 250grs of weight added on top of a 125 gr BH and 25gr alum insert to reach the weight needed for 25% FOC....with my 2117 arrow with a trimmed down tail weight with nock of 10grs and 2" blazers at 18grs that puts my 20" arrow at 638grs with 107lb of KE at 275fps....on mattise72 site i remember reading some of his charts he made to show some good info with 610gr arrows shot with a 200# exocet "which is what my xbow is" showing good fps and KE numbers....am i getting into to much of a numbers game here or what, i'm just trying to get the best stable flight from my arrows to stick them where it will count the most in an animal for the cleanest harvast it deserves....it's gettin real close to crunch time since getting my xbow with the back pay money from my disability so late in the year, ok fire on

...............bob

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aerostarp · Post by **aerostarp** » Wed Oct 01, 2008 10:10 am

....am i getting into to much of a numbers game here or what,

Reminds me of the guys who in the aviation magazines talk about the $25,000 to $50,000 modifications they would get on their airplanes and brag about the 5 - 10 Knots airspeed it would bring. I much preferred to save the money and fly "slower" by that amount.

A bolt that weight can be used as a baseball bat to club the deer with if your sting ever breaks.

bob1961 · Post by **bob1961** » Wed Oct 01, 2008 10:12 am

aerostarp wrote:A bolt that weight can be used as a baseball bat to club the deer with if your sting ever breaks.

umm, ok

................bob

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vixenmaster · Post by **vixenmaster** » Wed Oct 01, 2008 10:38 am

opens can of worms! what can you actually get by with in FOC ? spect everyone has a setup they or their CB likes! total arrow weight i like is min of 395 grs. thats why i am shooting deer with my old cast off 2213's. they only weigh 355 grs. but thats with a 100 gr BH of Field pt. going up another 25 or 35 grs would put them in that area. but i don't want to get rid of the BH's i use they shoot great out of 2216's. find what you and your Bow like and then when season is over play with it!

bob1961 · Post by **bob1961** » Wed Oct 01, 2008 11:11 am

i know what your saying smoke....i'm just trying to think of less vibration, noise and k.e. instead of speed and flatter trajectory....right now with the firebolts from the kit with 125 gr tips there at 380grs and 325fps but didn't shoot the 150gr boltcutters BH's to good....that's why i got rid of them....i was gonna go with the 125gr slick tricks anyway with my vert bow set up till my surgery had me go to xbow hunting....plus slowing the arrows down to 290 to 300fps the xbow will make a lot less noise and vibration and have more stable arrow flight from arrow to arrow with less stress on equipment....watching videos with 3-610gr arrows at 100 yards into a 2" group on a 3 - D deer target was impressive

..........bob

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vixenmaster · Post by **vixenmaster** » Wed Oct 01, 2008 11:29 am

ok i have piddled around abit. i have 7 or 8 slugged 2213's 22" long with 2013's inside of them. they weight 560 with my 100 gr BH's and hit like a mack truck when it meets a deer! you can add weight by putting a threaded rod inside and insert a few turns and glue it. you can buy brass round stock and add inside arrow shafts. i can take a 2219 and 5/16 brass rod in have arrows 1000 grs weight fairly quick

bob1961 · Post by **bob1961** » Wed Oct 01, 2008 2:43 pm

yup i have the same thing in mind the next trip to home depot instead of trying to find brass inserts the right size....i also have three 2215's a friend gave me cause he thought they were bent

five 2117's waiting to be cut and used, seven 2117's at the sport shop gettin cut to 20" and 2" blazers fletched just waiting to hear from him....in the mean time i have my firebolts i can add the proper weight behind the alum inserts to get the weight i want for the 18% FOC i'm looking for now to see how the arrows fly with them 125 tricks.............bob

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rm · Post by rm » Wed Oct 01, 2008 7:33 pm

If I may ask what kind of FOC would I be getting with the Firebolts 4" fletch and 100gr broadheads? Standard Excal bolts you buy off the shelf.

Thanks

awshucks · Post by **awshucks** » Wed Oct 01, 2008 7:48 pm

Back in '94 or '95 when I got my first Excal an Emax from Cabelas, I got the Right Stuff package. Ordered more arrows from some place in Pa, life was good. Then I got some arrows from my new found friend, Danny Miller.

They didn't match, 4" vanes vs 5" and brass inserts vs alum. I was distraught. Called Danny to see if I could switch them out. He asked if I even tried shooting them. No. Anal retentives like myself have preconceived notions, lol. Thus began my FOC education. Only fair to interject here my RS arrows/bheads did fine. My total weight w/ Danny's was around 430 gr w/ 100 gr points. He also turned me on to Slick Tricks, and as some of you other Danny fans know, he calls them "the best bhead" in the world.

GT changed wall thickness somewhere along the line, so same arrows today are a tad lighter. W/ 2" Blazers, around 405 gr w/ 100 gr points. 1-1.5" groups out to 50 yds.

Got a couple "Boo" Flemish Excels w/ served whiskers, added a STS that was gifted me and voila!! One real happy hill billy.

bob1961 · Post by **bob1961** » Wed Oct 01, 2008 8:55 pm

rm wrote:If I may ask what kind of FOC would I be getting with the Firebolts 4" fletch and 100gr broadheads? Standard Excal bolts you buy off the shelf.

Thanks

i weighed mine and did a balance test and they are 395 grs with a 125 tip and came in at 11.9 % FOC....give me bout ten minutes and i'll have some numbers for ya....i have a 100gr tip i can use on my firebolt.........bob

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bob1961 · Post by **bob1961** » Wed Oct 01, 2008 9:06 pm

rm....the arrow weighs 368gr with a 100gr tip and has a measurement of 1 13/16" balance point from center and a 8.5% FOC....hope this helped ya out..............bob

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Cossack · Post by **Cossack** » Thu Oct 02, 2008 7:54 am

"i can add the proper weight behind the alum inserts to get the weight i want for the 18% FOC i'm looking for now"

You're doing all that for 18%?

Gold Tip Lazer II's, brass inserts, 2" Blazers, 125 Slicks=+23% FOC at 425 grns.

bob1961 · Post by **bob1961** » Thu Oct 02, 2008 8:37 am

Cossack wrote:"i can add the proper weight behind the alum inserts to get the weight i want for the 18% FOC i'm looking for now"

You're doing all that for 18%?

Gold Tip Lazer II's, brass inserts, 2" Blazers, 125 Slicks=+23% FOC at 425 grns.

pretty much as the low % foc i have now isn't working with BH's to where i need them to go.............bob

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hetichunter · Post by **hetichunter** » Thu Oct 02, 2008 10:28 am

Great information here in this thread. Wish I understood it.

rm · Post by rm » Thu Oct 02, 2008 5:33 pm

Thanks Bob for working that out for me. From what I'm reading here and Excal now making 150gr broadheads I'm wondering if I'll be better off going to 125's or maybe even 150's?

I shoot a Phoenix with the flemish string so right now probably get 300-305FPS.

Anyone know how much speed I may loose with the two heavier heads using my set-up and will it worth it?