O/T Browning Canada Service On Firearms?

[10Ring]

I am curious as to anyone else's experience with this subject, i.e. dealing with Browning Canada for service, repairs or technical information of their firearm products.

I appologize for putting this on the Crossbow Forum but this is one of the more active Canadian sites where I thought I may get some replies.

My experience from 1980, to the present, has left a lot to be desired.

I believe they could learn a lot from Excalibur in this area.

[bbbwb]

I have not been served well. The only way I found to overcome the lack of service is to deal with Utah directly -- getting the info I need,determine available and then contact a local firearm dealer. The dealer goes through his regular channels to get what I need.
This takes time but addresses the situation.

bbbwb

[TPM]

This is a common topic on some shotgun forums I'm on. From some of the accounts I've read Browning service in Canada leaves a lot to be desired. I'm a huge Browning fan and have owned a number of them over the years but I've never had to have one serviced so I don't know first hand and I really don't want to find out. I had a Ruger Red Label shotgun which went back to their Canadian warranty center three times (worst piece-o-crap shotgun I ever owned, but that's another story) and each time took forever and they never did fix it right. It seems Canada is not a big enough market for some of these large companies to care about.

[mikej]

don't know about browning but winchester is hard to deal with when you're north of the border and since i heard last year winchester and browning merged i would have to assume that browning would be hard to deal with too. but again i've never dealt with them

[10Ring]

Thanks, I didn't think it was just me.

The only way I found to overcome the lack of service is to deal with Utah directly -- getting the info I need,determine available and then contact a local firearm dealer.

Yes, this has been my conclusion. I have started to do this and I find your questions get anwered, efficiently, politely, completely; all in a few minutes.

Fortunately for me, I have over 40 years of firearms & shooting experience and am a Mechanical Engineering Technologist who is very used to researching problems/solutions.

I have books on dissembling Citori's and just acquired a Browning "BT-99 Filed Service Manual", these help a lot. I don't mess with some parts such as stoning sears but these books help even for determining if the gunshop you are talking to knows their stuff, or not.

I don't know what the average person that doesn't have even these resources does.

It seems Canada is not a big enough market for some of these large companies to care about.

Yes, I am afraid that is correct.

I find that when calling Browning Canada, they don't know the product and sadly, hve the attitide that they don't care. I read in a business listing that the Browning Canada office has about 7 people; I suspect a few clerical, mostly sales people, IMHO, as long as they are selling stuff, they don't care.

In my case, this was a 2005 manufacture BT-99 that I acquired, new in 2007 as a 30 year service award.

In 7,000 rounds, the trigger pull went from 64 oz.'s to 28 oz.'s, way too light for a trap gun IMHO.

I removed the butt stock, for the first time to check for dirt between the sear and trigger, none was there. I found a broken "Trigger Return Spring", this was added to the design in 2000 when the BT-99 weas re-introduced when they dropped the BT-100.

I thought this was the source of the light trigger weight.

I wrote a letter to Browning Canada, weeks later, after no response I called. They did not know about the spring and "perhaps I had modified my gun......." Yeah, right (It was th first time I had it apart).

I found from U.S. sources the spring was added to the gun but doesn't show on the parts diagrams. The changed the design of the spring in 2006, I expect due to breakage.

I got an new Trigger Return Spring from the U.S., it was not the problem, as far as the light trigger pull. It brought hte weight up about 10 oz. but not enough.

I got the BT-99 Filed Service Manual two weeks ago, a few minutes reading and a brief examination told me the sear was worn (very prematurely for trap gun, at around 7,000 rounds, lots on BT-99's go 100,000+ on one sear).

A new sear is on the way, from a U.S. source. I will install it and check it as per the BT-99 Filed Service Manual with my RCBS Trigger Scale, if it passes the "book requirements" and is 4 to 5 pounds, all will be well. If it needs stoning, I will be looking for someone who knows what they are doing an does it for a living.

IMHO, it is sad that we have to go to these levels to keep a gun working. Trouble is, I like the guns, themselves and a "boycott of one" doesn't "teach" them anything so I do use them but in my experience, if you have a problem in this country with one, you are on your own.

In conclusion: to my surprise, I received a Trigger Return Spring from Montreal (with a $15.00 invoice), last week; 3 monts after my first contact with them.

[10Ring]

In case someone thinks the response I got from Browning Canada was brought on by me approachig them in a rude manner, her is a copy of the letter I sent in January when I had the problem;

Here is an exact copy of the letter except for serial No. and contact info, mailed Jan 21, 2009.;

January 21, 2009


Re: BT-99, Trigger Pull Issue, Serial No. XXXXMVXXX


I would like to determine the cause an issue I have with my BT-99 and determine the best way to have it addressed.

The gun recently developed a trigger pull weight of 2 pounds, as measured by my RCBS Trigger Pull Gauge. This is too light and is a change from when I acquired the gun.

The gun had a spring that does not appear on the enclosed diagram of an older BT-99, (the gun in the diagram has the older features of a long tang trigger guard and an ejector). This is a small, two-pronged spring, secured to the interior of the trigger plate with a slotted screw, behind the trigger. The two prongs on the spring bore down on the rear of the trigger.

Both “legs” of the round wire spring on this gun have broken off at the slotted screw head, so the spring doesn’t function now.

The sear surfaces are unaltered and appear to be in good condition. The gun has fired an estimated 5,000 to 10,000 shells. I assume the “MV” in the serial number indicates 2005 manufacture.

· Is the round wire spring a recent design revision?
· Could the broken spring account for the reduced trigger pull weight?
· I assume this gun is out of warranty by now but could you recommend the best course of action to have it repaired?

I acquired this gun, new, in Feb. 2007, as a 30-year service award; I am the original owner.

Any assistance would be appreciated.




10Ring & address etc. (please contact me by email, if that is more convenient)

(Marked up color photo and parrts diagram of an older BT-99 were enclosed, as well.)

In the letter, I said the sear appears to be in good condition.

I did not have anything to compar it too.

The BT-99 Field Service Manual I acquired in April told me what to look for. While the wearing surface looks smooth, the sear is radiused, not straight. The book indicates this will result in a lightened trigger pull.

[bbbwb]

10Ring:
Like you said, I am glad to hear of other experiences and it is not just me.
Your problem was more complicated than mine. I was wanting an Auto 5- 20 ga magazine tube cap with swivel attachment.
However all is solved and a solution is at hand. Glad that you were successful as well.

bbbwb

[swiftfox]

10Ring go to ontario trophybuck forum under firearms all kinds of help there for manual's. got my auto 5 manual and superposed one there Swiftfox

[bbbwb]

Swiftfox:
Glad to hear of another Auto 5 owner. Don't hear to many people speak of them. I am glad I have company.

bbbwb

[10Ring]

Swiftfox:
Glad to hear of another Auto 5 owner. Don't hear to many people speak of them. I am glad I have company.

bbbwb

I have owned four over the years and still have my Dad's 1963 Light Twelve.

[bbbwb]

10Ring:
I was at a shop Saturday and saw one on the shelf. I forgot the serial # but it was a Light 12, 2 3/4 " chamber, Belgium, same as mine , super condition ---- $695.95.
I bought my daughter a 20 ga ,3"chamber, 1967, in super condition last year. They are a reliable firearm and have appreciated in value as all else.

I have had good times and memories with old hump back, but we all have our favourites.

bbbwb

[Hi5]

10 Ring

Why don't you go to http://www.canadiangunnutz.com/ and raise your concerns there? They have a very large membership, and you very well might connect with other people who have had a similar problem.

[10Ring]

10 Ring

Why don't you go to http://www.canadiangunnutz.com/ and raise your concerns there? They have a very large membership, and you very well might connect with other people who have had a similar problem.

Thanks, but as previously noted, I have my answer as to what the problem is;

I got the BT-99 Field Service Manual two weeks ago, a few minutes reading and a brief examination told me the sear was worn (very prematurely for trap gun, at around 7,000 rounds, lots on BT-99's go 100,000+ on one sear).

A new sear is on the way, from a U.S. source. I will install it and check it as per the BT-99 Filed Service Manual with my RCBS Trigger Scale, if it passes the "book requirements" and is 4 to 5 pounds, all will be well. If it needs stoning, I will be looking for someone who knows what they are doing an does it for a living.

There is not much that will change the service from Browning Canada, unless the parent company really lays the law down or comes in and "cleans house".

Actually, I have had trouble getting on that forum or communicating w/it. On gun forums, I use the name Claydust, I have tried registering on it under that name, it comes back saying the name is taken but it is not on their membership list. I have basically given up on it in frustration.