Is it time to upgrade? UPDATE!!!!!!!

raydaughety · Post by **raydaughety** » Sun Sep 13, 2009 2:52 pm

After shooting one deer yesterday, we saw another deer come through and it was no where near dark but I could not get that deer focused through my maxzone scope. I could see the deer fine at 40 yards with my naked eye but could barely see her through the scope. Is it time for a varizone or an illumizone? Which one? And do I need a new mount. I'll need to have it modified by Danny Miller to accomidate my accudraw.

UPDATE!!!!!!

My new VARIZONE came in yesterday and when I pulled the old dropZone off of my Exomag, I found something very disturbing. As I was packing the old scope up for the return to Danny, I saw that the scope had dents at the front underside of it where the arrow retainer spring had been hittting it. This very well may be the problem with the scope!!! How will I stop it from happening to my new lumizone? Has anyone ever had this problem?

saxman · Post by **saxman** » Sun Sep 13, 2009 2:57 pm

Ray,I have a lumi-zone here if you want to try it?

Grizzly Adam · Post by **Grizzly Adam** » Sun Sep 13, 2009 3:07 pm

I don't know if a Vari or a Lumi would make much of a difference, Ray.

I can say this: My Varizone scope doesn't have nearly the light-gathering capabilities of the Leupold scope on my deer rifle ... not even close. As scopes go, it literally is the difference between night and day.

Not to knock the Varizone ... after all, it's a cheap scope, and in scopes, you get what you pay for. I wouldn't expect a sub-$200 scope to have excellent light-gathering qualities ... and the Vari doesn't.

At least, mine don't!

I'm sure someone will insist theirs is like night-vision equipment.

That's OK ... as they say, "Your mileage may vary!"

wabi · Post by **wabi** » Sun Sep 13, 2009 3:19 pm

Grizz,
I will agree with you 100% on this one!
The Excalibur scopes are great crossbow scopes, but in the world of competition the price of a very high quality scope would prohibit sales.
I have used a Leupold on my crossbow, but I finally took it off for fear of trashing it. I have ruined a less expensive rifle scope on the crossbow, they just aren't designed for the unique recoil of a crossbow.

Ray,
That's a very generous offer Sax made, sounds like a good way to find out if the Lumi is the way to go.

sumner4991 · Post by **sumner4991** » Sun Sep 13, 2009 3:38 pm

Out of either scope, lumi or vari . . .after dusk, I can see better out of the scope than my naked eye. I can see a little better out of the lumi than the vari, but, it is a VERY little difference.

Cossack · Post by **Cossack** » Sun Sep 13, 2009 3:40 pm

I love my 2 Lumis, but the Hawke MAP on my compound is very nice too. Much smaller but not lighted. Comes with a trajectory calculation program. BUT shooting two excals, of different speeds, I have the Lumis shoot to the same point of aim with both bows. No thinking about where to aim from one to the other. NICE.

michiganman · Post by **michiganman** » Sun Sep 13, 2009 10:15 pm

i have had the varizone scope since december,and just upgraded to the lumizone.in back yard in dark areas,i could loose my cross hair some,and with the setting lit on one,made a big difference.i would have to wear glasses if not for the scopes.for my self in low light the lighted cross hairs will help some.

Boo · Post by **Boo** » Sun Sep 13, 2009 10:40 pm

Grizzly Adam wrote:I don't know if a Vari or a Lumi would make much of a difference, Ray.

I can say this: My Varizone scope doesn't have nearly the light-gathering capabilities of the Leupold scope on my deer rifle ... not even close. As scopes go, it literally is the difference between night and day.

Not to knock the Varizone ... after all, it's a cheap scope, and in scopes, you get what you pay for. I wouldn't expect a sub-$200 scope to have excellent light-gathering qualities ... and the Vari doesn't.

At least, mine don't!

I'm sure someone will insist theirs is like night-vision equipment.

That's OK ... as they say, "Your mileage may vary!"

I'll have to agree with this one a whole lot. Without question the upper end rifle scopes have far better light management then the Varizone or Lumizone. Without my rifle scopes on my bows I would not be hunting the last half hour of legal shooting time. Having said that it's hard to beat the price of them vs what they do for you.

Tenn. Equinox · Post by **Tenn. Equinox** » Sun Sep 13, 2009 11:24 pm

Boo
What brand of rifle scopes do you have on yur bows, Boo.
And have you had any trouble with any of them.
I've been thinking about going this way for awhile.

Boo · Post by **Boo** » Sun Sep 13, 2009 11:44 pm

My favorite is a 1.75X6 32 VariX III. I used to use a 3.5X9X40 VariX III with good success as well as a 1.5X6X36 B&L 4200. I've been toying with the idea of a 1.25X4X24 B&L 4200 with a illuminated dot. The dot is extremely small, it might work well. I know they are lots of money but much has been said to buy the best optics you can afford then buy a rifle meaning spend more on the optic than the rifle(within reason and budget). There is a vast difference in the clarity of better scopes compared to cheap scopes. I still have to say that a Varizone is perfect for the beginner. It will let them hunt and shoot 3D with great success,

dick195252 · Post by **dick195252** » Mon Sep 14, 2009 2:23 am

I would take Scott up on his offer, and find out for yourself in the field, under true hunting conditions.

Grizzly Adam · Post by **Grizzly Adam** » Mon Sep 14, 2009 3:42 am

Boo wrote: I still have to say that a Varizone is perfect for the beginner.

Yeah ... I think the Varizone (and the Lumizone, I assume) is a fine scope for what it is, and it seems to be about as good as what I'd expect for the price.

As Wabi observed, there's no way Excal could provide a high-end scope as part of the Right Stuff package, for instance. I think they've done a good job providing a default scope. I don't think the scopes are any great disadvantage.

Boo, is the strange backward "recoil" signature of a crossbow not injurious to rifle-scopes after all, then, or is it a matter of which rifle-scope is used?

I know a guy who's been using a Leupold Vari-X III on a heavy spring-piston air rifle for years, without failure, and I know that's supposed to be a no-no!

Guess you never know!

Your experience in this matter is valuable info, though!

Boo · Post by **Boo** » Mon Sep 14, 2009 7:04 am

No decent scope will fail from the recoil of a crossbow. Contrary to misbelief the impulse is towards the shooter. Remember you high school physics? The arrow is being shoved forward so the recoil is in the opposite direction. I was shooting my Paradox with a heavy arrow last weekend in a dumb crouched position with my knee up near the heel of the stock butt and got a really good whack! I don't think the recoil is near as sharp or as damaging as any shotgun or any medium bore rifle. The time span of any recoil is what causes the damage and in a crossbow I think it's pretty long.

Pydpiper · Post by **Pydpiper** » Mon Sep 14, 2009 7:27 am

I am thinking about trying a decent scope after this season, it will be a Leopold or a Bushnell 4200, both scopes are decent with the Bushnell having the advantage of rain-guard. However, a Leopold can be sent in to have the extra chevrons added relatively inexpensively.
I am pretty happy with the Lumi-Zone for now, but as I start to get in to using a climber I can see the inner woods being darker than field edge at sunset/sunrise.
That is a generous offer from Scott, it would at least let you try one before you take the plunge.

PA_DeerHunter · Post by **PA_DeerHunter** » Mon Sep 14, 2009 7:30 am

True about the recoil, but a spring-piston air rifle, of which I have many, does the same thing, yet are notorious for destroying rifle scopes. The piston's bounce-back after it's initial forward thrust is what messes up the scope. A crossbow's string does more than thrust forward. It also bounces back and forth, much like a spring-piston's bounce, that causes all kinds of vibration. I would imagine that a scope which is not reinforced inside could have problems with such vibration...even high end scopes.