Power stroke/Draw lenght

[kamont]

Just wondering if i am reading the Ontario hunting regs right or not. Crossbows must have a draw length of at least 11.8 " whereas the Matrix 330 only has a draw of 11.4" does this mean it cannot be used for hunting??

[cjonesth]

Read this thread.

http://www.excaliburcrossbow.com/phpBB2 ... =1&t=51523

[kamont]

Read this thread.

http://www.excaliburcrossbow.com/phpBB2 ... =1&t=51523

OK what am I missing???

[cjonesth]

Sorry wrong post. Try this one.

http://www.excaliburcrossbow.com/phpBB2 ... =1&t=51429

[cjonesth]

This one explains it better.

http://www.excaliburcrossbow.com/phpBB2 ... th#p489973

[kamont]

So the power stroke is not the draw length

[pstjohn]

I'm looking at an Excalibur crossbow for my first bow hunt this fall and had the same question regarding whether or not the Matrix 330 met the requirements for Ontario. Sent an inquiry to the MNR and the following is the response I just just received today (Spoiler alert: Short answer is 'no').

Hello,

Thank you for your inquiry.

What enforcement is measuring in the field is from where your bow string rests (crossbow uncocked), to where it locks back in the cocking/trigger mechanism at full draw. The draw length, or power stroke must be a minimum of 300 mm (11.8”).

We hope you find this information helpful. If you require further assistance, please contact the Natural Resources Information Centre at 1-800-667-1940.

Regards,

NRIC web reader - CG
************************************
Ministry of Natural Resources and Forestry
Natural Resources Information Centre
300 Water Street, P.O. Box 7000
Peterborough, ON K9J 8M5
1-800-667-1940
TTY: 1-866-686-6072
Fax: 705-755-1677
[email protected]

Has the person responding to me made a mistake? I can't say for certain, but it *is* the reply from an MNR representative.

-P.

[Bones]

I'm looking at an Excalibur crossbow for my first bow hunt this fall and had the same question regarding whether or not the Matrix 330 met the requirements for Ontario. Sent an inquiry to the MNR and the following is the response I just just received today (Spoiler alert: Short answer is 'no').

Hello,

Thank you for your inquiry.

What enforcement is measuring in the field is from where your bow string rests (crossbow uncocked), to where it locks back in the cocking/trigger mechanism at full draw. The draw length, or power stroke must be a minimum of 300 mm (11.8”).

We hope you find this information helpful. If you require further assistance, please contact the Natural Resources Information Centre at 1-800-667-1940.

Regards,

NRIC web reader - CG
************************************
Ministry of Natural Resources and Forestry
Natural Resources Information Centre
300 Water Street, P.O. Box 7000
Peterborough, ON K9J 8M5
1-800-667-1940
TTY: 1-866-686-6072
Fax: 705-755-1677
[email protected]

Has the person responding to me made a mistake? I can't say for certain, but it *is* the reply from an MNR representative.

-P.

Yup they have !! Measured from the outer edge of the limb to latch ! according to online and paper reg's !!

[way123hockey]

The draw length of a crossbow is measured along the bolt ramp (where the bolt rests) from outer edge of the main limb, to the anchor point (release latch mechanism) at full draw.
This was taken from the OHEP "Ontario Hunter Education Program" website.

[pstjohn]

The draw length of a crossbow is measured along the bolt ramp (where the bolt rests) from outer edge of the main limb, to the anchor point (release latch mechanism) at full draw.
This was taken from the OHEP "Ontario Hunter Education Program" website.

The ambiguities in that text is exactly why I contacted the MNR.
- What is the "main limb"? a recurve xbow has two limbs. No illustration of a crossbow I looked at labelled anything as a "main limb".
- What is the "outer edge"? I can think of at least two interpretations (see attached image)

draw_length.PNG (11.91 KiB) Viewed 8043 times

Frankly, the reply from the MNR surprised me. I expected their definition to be from where the two limbs attach to the body to the anchor point. Otherwise the Matrix 330 (a more powerful bow than, say, the Axiom) can't be used for deer but a less powerful bow can be.

Perhaps as a [soon to be] new bow hunter I'm over analysing this, but the last thing I want when out in the woods to have my hunt ruined on a technicality. Maybe I will call the number provided and get a clarification on the clarification...

-P.

[ehntr]

The draw length of a crossbow is measured along the bolt ramp (where the bolt rests) from outer edge of the main limb, to the anchor point (release latch mechanism) at full draw.
This was taken from the OHEP "Ontario Hunter Education Program" website.

The ambiguities in that text is exactly why I contacted the MNR.
- What is the "main limb"? a recurve xbow has two limbs. No illustration of a crossbow I looked at labelled anything as a "main limb".
- What is the "outer edge"? I can think of at least two interpretations (see attached image)

draw_length.PNG

Frankly, the reply from the MNR surprised me. I expected their definition to be from where the two limbs attach to the body to the anchor point. Otherwise the Matrix 330 (a more powerful bow than, say, the Axiom) can't be used for deer but a less powerful bow can be.

Perhaps as a [soon to be] new bow hunter I'm over analysing this, but the last thing I want when out in the woods to have my hunt ruined on a technicality. Maybe I will call the number provided and get a clarification on the clarification...

-P.

Your diagram on the left is "draw length" while the diagram on the right is "power stroke"

[way123hockey]

The draw length is measured along the bolt ramp. So the picture on the left.

[awshucks]

pst....john

Do you think a Can co would sell xbows not legal in Can?

[dutchhunter]

why not thy sell them all over the world for hunting and target shooting even are azze friends enjoy them Dutch

[pstjohn]

pst....john

Do you think a Can co would sell xbows not legal in Can?

I feel I really need to clarify a some points.

1) All my discussion has been for Ontario only. I have not looked into nor inquired about regulations in other provinces and territories of Canada.

2) Whether or not a particular crossbow is within specifications for hunting big game in Ontario is not the same as saying selling, buying or using the crossbow for other purposes is illegal.

3) The intent of my original post was to pass along the information provided by the MNR (Ministry of Natural Resources) - the legal entity responsible for setting and enforcing hunting regulations in Ontario. The statement regarding in-field measuring of draw length is theirs, not mine.

Does it seem crazy that a more powerful bow would not be in specs when a less powerful bow with a longer power stroke would be? Yep, sure does.

Does it seem nuts that Excalibur would produce a 'big game' bow that can't be used for big game in some places? Yep, sure does.

Have I ever seen regulations that I didn't agree with or think made sense? You betcha. Regardless I try very hard to stay on the legal side.

Would it surprise me that the MNR representative responding to me got it wrong? Nope, not at all.

Would I feel antsy out in the woods hunting with a bow when I'm on record asking if the specs of that very bow met Ontario big game hunting regulations and was told in no uncertain terms by the governing entity that it did not? I certainly would. But then again I'm an anal sort of fella.

As it turns out, I think I've settled on the 380 as the bow I will get (which for me makes the matter mote). Regardless I may pursue further inquiry to the MNR on this matter simply out of curiosity.

Good luck to everyone in this fall's hunt.

-P.