Kinetic Energy

[tripNchip]

Was just looking at the chart for arrow performance and was wondering what the acceptable kinetic energy is as fare as arrow penetration is concerned on deer sized game? I realize this can change by type of broad head, cutting diamitor, number of blades and so on. But under ideal conditions what should kinetic energy be at point of impact on a deer?

[ehntr]

You will get a varienty of answers no doubt. I don't even think on those terms anymore. Excalibur doesn't make a hunting crossbow that isn't more than equipped to deliver sufficient KE to kill a deer. Considering that most if not all jurisdictions have a minimum (and even maximum sometimes) draw weight for differing species of animals, your question has already been answered by the imposition of a minimum draw weight. 40# at 28 " is routinely stated as the minimum draw weight for a bow when hunting big game in many regulations. Miniumum crossbow draw weights are also provided in hunting regulations, where crossbows are allowed. http://www.excaliburcrossbow.com/content/display/select

[paulaboutform]

I really think there are too many variables to just give a blanket answer. As already mentioned, what's the draw weight, arrow weight, type of b.h., f.o.c., distance to the target, type and size of animal, shot angle....etc...

[DuckHunt]

Under ideal conditions, more is better. You are correct that their are too many variables. A couple decades ago many 40# bows were shooting 400 grain arrows less than 200fps. That is KE in the low 30# range. They killed deer. Would I want 30# of KE today? No. I would prefer closer to 50. That is why I shoot a bow that will generate closer to 90#. It provides more margin for the unexpected like a shoulder blade that wasn't there when you released the arrow.

DuckHunt

[nchunterkw]

As paul said - many many variables. Here is a link to some great data collected by Ed Ashby. He explains it all very well, and it is based on real hunting data. Probably a bit overkill for whitetails, but the principles hold no doubt. Good reading.

http://www.alaskabowhunting.com/Ashby-O ... n-W19.aspx

[Mister B]

Mini-Pearl, my new 335 blackout, with a 17 in BEE, 3 in Duravanes, 130 gr brass inserts, Lumenok, and Rage Extreme 100gr BH gets 94.4 KE.
Cheers

[vodek]

More is better for hunting. I get 95 KE of energy with 446 gr arrow.
Minimum for me it is 70 KE. There is easy calculator at Gold Tips Arrows web side.

[galamb]

While KE is kinda the gold standard that everyone "thinks" they understand and the industry holds out as some "holy grail" to determine the terminal ballistics, as others have kinda said, it's really misleading.

My recurve, impacts at 25 yards with a "whopping" 37 pounds of KE, but since I shoot a 491 grain arrow/broadhead combo the "slug force" is more than sufficient to get a complete pass through on a broadside shot through the boiler room.

My Vixen II, Excal's "weakest" bow, in comparison, hits with about 57 pounds of KE @ 25 yards shooting a 394 grain bolt/broadhead (at 40 yards it has only dropped off to 54 lbs).

At 25 yards that's 54% more KE than my recurve - and if I place the shot correctly, it will pass through as well.

As someone else stated - if you do your part, anything Excalibur makes has way way way more than enough energy regardless of what broadhead and arrow you are shooting, unless you colour way outside the lines..

(should have added - if you ask the guys on the rifle forums, you will get unanimous agreement that you need 1000 lbs of KE to kill a deer - thank the great Bow God we have slug force/momentum)

[nchunterkw]

While KE is kinda the gold standard that everyone "thinks" they understand and the industry holds out as some "holy grail" to determine the terminal ballistics, as others have kinda said, it's really misleading.

My recurve, impacts at 25 yards with a "whopping" 37 pounds of KE, but since I shoot a 491 grain arrow/broadhead combo the "slug force" is more than sufficient to get a complete pass through on a broadside shot through the boiler room.

My Vixen II, Excal's "weakest" bow, in comparison, hits with about 57 pounds of KE @ 25 yards shooting a 394 grain bolt/broadhead (at 40 yards it has only dropped off to 54 lbs).

At 25 yards that's 54% more KE than my recurve - and if I place the shot correctly, it will pass through as well.

As someone else stated - if you do your part, anything Excalibur makes has way way way more than enough energy regardless of what broadhead and arrow you are shooting, unless you colour way outside the lines..

(should have added - if you ask the guys on the rifle forums, you will get unanimous agreement that you need 1000 lbs of KE to kill a deer - thank the great Bow God we have slug force/momentum)

X2
Can't suggest reading the Ashby document strongly enough. Explains a lot about how to get good arrow penetration.

[tripNchip]

Thanks for the reply's, and I will check out both sites mentioned as they should answer my real question as to how fare a person might shoot game if the shot was looked at accordingly to kinetic energy, taking away all other variables.
As fare as the rifle hunters are concerned, ( now don't jump on me because I have rifle hunted and reloaded more years then I have bow hunted) the need for more KE went up with the introduction of mag. rifles and other new calibers. but that is an all different topic.
Thanks again for the responses and have a blessed day.